My REVIEW at EVERM Dental Clinic + consultation journey at other places

[robinrenren]

My REVIEW at EVERM Dental Clinic + (consultation journey with VIEW, D.A, Yonsei Severance Hospital, Seoul National Dental Hospital)


I’m male, living in London, 25 years old, Asian, 2,5 months post-operatively. In Feb 2015, I headed to Seoul for two-jaw surgery, V-line and cheekbone shaving surgery. I had consultations with a good few clinics & hospitals before deciding to have my surgery at EVERM.

Note 1: I’m trying to share my own experience with EverM and knowledge about the two-jaw surgery in as much detail as possible. I never attempted to write this review in order to promote any clinics to benefit myself simply because I think my plastic surgery journey is over. So please don’t ask me about the price and suchlike. All I can share is that I got a very good deal from EVERM since I did multiple procedures at the same time. If you were thinking of having the same multiple procedures like me, you would have the very same bargain power!

Note 2: I am still not sure about the final result, so making judgement at this point seems to be imprudent. Instead, I’ll be keeping you guys updated about my recovery progress on the monthly basis in the next 6 months. Afterwards, I will finalize my result and satisfaction level.

I divide my review into 3 parts so that you guys can read and follow more easily.

Part 1: Clinics Review
Part 2: Two-jaw surgery, some real facts!
Part 3: Monthly progress
--------------------------------------

 

[robinrenren]

Part 1: Clinics Review

1. View: This is the first clinic I visited. I chose to come here on my friends’ advice but the problem is that those friends did either nose job or V-line while I am more interested in two-jaw. But in the end, I thought having a face-to-face consultation there would do me no harm. The general atmosphere was nice. Everyone seemed hectic as there were quite a lot of new and old patients present at the clinic. I managed to meet the consultant first and then the doctor specializing in two-jaw. He explained to me carefully how the surgery is performed and what to expect afterwards. Generally speaking, I found what he said fair enough and truthful. However, what made me quite hesitate was his qualification. He is not actually a maxillofacial specialist, just plastic surgeon. Plus, the price they quoted after bargain was higher compared to that of EVERM. Ok, it’s time to say goodbye then!

2. D.A: I would totally agree with other Purse forumers that they come across as a very problematic clinic in terms of management and customer relationship issues. I felt ill at ease right the moment I came here. The staff were working unenthusiastically as if they were going through the motions. And the doctor didn’t even take the bother to talk to me as a patient. He explained as if Two-jaw was just a piece of cake! Besides, they tried to lure me into many unnecessary procedures like nose, aculift, blab la bla. The price was hilariously expensive, 30 million won for cheekbone + Vline+ two jaw No thanks! I left the clinic without so much as saying goodbye.

3. Seoul N. Dental Hospital: This is the general hospital fully-equipped with modern technologies to perform two-jaw. Had it not been for the timing, I would definitely have chosen this place over EVERM. As far as I know they have very experienced doctors and are one of the safest places to have plastic surgeries. Too bad that I had to wait 6 weeks after the consultation in order to have the two-jaw surgery. The price was transparent and fixed, be you locals or foreigners: 18-20 mill won for two jaw, 2-3 mill for Cheekbone , 2-3 mill for Chin advancement. (No major price inflation over the time)

 Tips: IF any clinics you guys visit quote a higher price than this, I strongly recommend you guys choose right away this hospital. And for those who are not on the budget, I think SNDH is totally worth a try! Apparently, it is not hard to see how popular they are among local people when I had to wait 6 weeks for my turn to have the surgery! Definitely the safest place compared to all other clinics on the market.

4. Yonsei Dental (Severance Hospital): this is the hospital of the same league as Seoul N.D.Hospital. Again, I would strongly recommend you guys to go for this hospital if you are not on the budget. It has lots of highly qualified doctors and staff with excellent service, and you don’t have to wait much for the surgery. In fact, they scheduled me the surgery 3 days after the consultation.

Moreover, there are many Maxillofacial professors at Yonsei Med University who also work at or liaise with the hospital. No apprentices are allowed to perform surgeries here. So don’t worry about some rumors in the forum that you may end up with an apprentice doctor when coming to Yonsei or Seoul N. D. H! Lie, Lie, Lie! Not a Chance!
The only thing that put me off is the price they quoted: it was quite high: cheekbone + Vline + two jaw = 35-40 mil won. (excluding other fees like CT, Xray, room, service, etc).

5. EverM : I would say I was impressed with this clinic from doctor Yoon to Ga Hee and the staff in the frist place. But some of them here of course still leaves a lot to be desired. I will talk more about some ‘drawbacks’ that EVERM has because no clicnic is perfect at the end of the journey.

They come across as nice, tender and truthful people. I could feel it straight away the moment I met Ga Hee and Doctor Yoon. (and Dr. Seo is nice and caring too! To be honest, he’s quite funny an assistant doctor  who attempts very much to speak English to you!). There was no pushing or rushing ambience at all at this clinic. Everything was very calm and tranquil. I waited in the lounge area for a while before Ga Hee walked me to a room to meet the clinic manager and Dr. Yoon. Personally, I was not interested in the manager who was quite cheeky and money-oriented (as typical of all clinics managers!), so let’s not talk about her. Dr. Yoon, by contrast, appeared very cool, calm and collected. Though he couldn’t speak English, but I could feel in my bones that I can trust this doctor.

 Tips: just choose the ones you feel comfortable with and they are also comfortable with you because at the end of the day, it is they who perform your surgeries. If you and the doctor don’t hit it off, then you shouldn’t put your life into his hand!

After we had a 15-min discussion about the procedures I should have, we agreed that I should have two-jaw + v-line + cheekbone but just shaving. He was the only doctor that advised me against having it reduced by using 3D technique cuz I am not a suitable candidate for it. Just a little shaving would do! At that point, he totally won my trust as I knew it at the bottom of my heart that I only need some shaving.

Furthermore, a big star for EVERM is that Dr. Yoon and his assistant Dr.Seo, also Yonsei – Maxilloficial major, are quite strict about workload. This means they only perform maximum 2-3 cases per day. Ga Hee informed me about it at first and I was impressed, thus being happy to wait for my turn. To be more specific, I had to wait one week later after the consultation day in order to have the surgery as his schedule had been fully reserved for other patients who came before me! So it is certain that swapping doctors is not a practice at EVERM. I even had a chance to double-check this fact when I stayed in the ward for 7 days (reason is below). Every single day, I walked to and fro, back and forth to all the rooms to see how many new patients were admitted. I can now ascertain that the maximum new patients are 2-3 ones per day. Some days, there was only 1 new patient admitted. This is a good sign as Dr. Yoon would not prefer to exhaust himself just to earn some more money, and is more concerned about the quality and safety of all surgeries he performs.

*reason that I stayed in the ward for 7 days: My body reacted quite differently from other people. I got a very bad swelling shortly after the surgery, so much so that both doctors agreed that I could stay here longer if need be, and I wouldn’t be charged for the extra day fee. Apparently, they took my health status and safety priority to all, which I wholeheartedly appreciated! Simply Excellent aftercare service! I felt warm at heart that I was really cared as a patient and a human, not a partner in a commercial transaction! Coming back to the swelling story, my swelling reached its peak on the second day and started to decrease on the 3rd day onwards.

 Tips: it is depend on each person’s body in reaction to swelling. For some, the swelling peaks on the 3rd, 4rd day after the surgery. For some like me, it peaks straight away on the 2nd day. So don’t be worried too much! Next, 4 days in the ward room passed by and then came the breathing problem. I was extremely hard of breathing due to oral & nasal swelling and bleeding. Blood and phlegm just kept oozing out of my nose! Really gross! Dr. Seo decided that they would carefully monitor my status to make sure everything is ok before I was discharged, and he agreed to let me stay until the day before New Year celebration in Korea (19 Feb). I couldn’t thank him more! (7 DAYS at EVERM ..WOW!)

 

[robinrenren]

Aftercare at EVERM: a tender loving care can be totally expected! (Except for a crazy *****y nurse. Yes there is always an odd man out of the team as there goes a saying!)

During my 7-day ‘journey’ in the ward, I met all the nurses working at EVERM, and even managed to remember exactly their shifts! Quite fun! Haha! There are 5 nurses working there, 1 person per shift. The ward room is guarded 24/7. When you need their help, just press the button, and they’ll be there with you. Generally speaking, I was all impressed by their tender care and attitude. I noticed that they were working with their heart and all their effort, though their job is not easy at all. I consider myself perhaps the most troublesome patient ever at EVERM. I was like a baby after the surgery. During the first 2 days, I literally kept calling them every 20 mins when I couldn’t breath and need blood suction or just to ask them to help me change the garment. Without fail, most of them approached me patiently and nicely, and helped me with the requests, except the crazy nurse I mentioned above. I know many of those having surgery at EverM also had to put up with her attitude. I decided to inform Ga Hee about it. And the big boss at EverM was later informed about the incident. It was understood that she was called to the office. What happened next, I think we can all guess. Later on, she seemed to change her behavior a bit by using her phone with a very bad translation app to communicate with me, and I ended up not understanding a thing she tried to say. Too much drama! Perhaps, I’d better not try to ask her for help anymore. That is the way that works out for both of us. And of course, we’d been sworn enemies since then! I hope (upon the stars) that she will get the sack well before any of you guys choose EVERM to have surgery in the future.

That said, I was very lucky when taken care by other nurses who were like angels. Had it not been for them, I would have ‘rocked’ EVERM up !!!

 Tip: IF any of you guys might have had surgery at EVERM in the future, just demand to have the surgery on the date when Nurse. Na Hyun Joo is on shift. Then, you will be enjoying the ‘tender loving care’ she is bound to ‘deliver’. The first night after the surgery is usually a nightmare, so having her with you is nothing short of a blessing. She’s the most tender and caring nurse at EVERM, and I believe many locals have the same opinion about her as I do. Evidence? During my stay, I witnessed a good few patients coming back to give her some thank-you presents. (Only to her).

As for Ga Hee, she was helping me more than her job asks for. She was by my side when I was weakest, usually passing by my room to check me up and keep me company before she went home. Therefore, it stands to reason that she’s been promoted as a customer relationship manager at EVERM. She simply deserves it! (I still keep her business card ). Just try to approach her as a person, and then you will see she is lovely lady by nature!

That’s that !

 

[robinrenren]

________________________________________________________
Part 2: Two-jaw surgery, some real facts!

It is not a just-for-fun type of surgery by nature. Thus, unless you suffer from the malocclusion or jaw asymmetry, please don’t go for it. You will be put through a lot of drama on the way to recovery.

Research, research and research. That’s the only way that helps you to have a clear and whole big picture of this type of surgery. By saying research, I didn’t mean that you just limit yourself by scavenging some threads about two-jaw surgery in the forum. Try to find more information about it in other sources. If you’re still students, you may benefit immensely from the academic research databases. They literally have all sorts of things there, ranging from business field, music, arts, medical, and engineering. In a word, they are treasure chest of human knowledge. Stick to them! Okay, back to the databases, more often than not, you students will have free access to such databases as International Medical Journals, SAGE, etc. Your schools certainly pay a small fortune annually to keep these databases free for students and professors, so make full use of it!!! Just key in “orthognatic or two-jaw surgery”, many research articles worldwide will start to pop up in front of you momentarily. READ THEM as many as you can. That’s the most effective way to have good understanding of this type of surgery. Alternatively, you may search them in www.scholar.google.com , but free-to-read articles are quite few and far between. Anyway, just stick to research articles, and I think you’ll be okay.

Complications of Two-jaw surgery:

As for me, I tried to search in the academic databases with key words like ‘complications’ + ‘orthognatic surgery’ and I was displayed a good many articles discussing them.

Notable: Otitis Media = middle-ear-infection due to two-jaw surgery, vocal cord damage due to intubation, lymph nodes along the jaw (may develop to Abscess if not treated), sinus enlargement, etc… (For all surgeries related to the throat and head area, we all need intubation for general anesthesia and it may well cause ‘vocal cord damage’, or worse, vocal cord paralysis, you guys can ‘google’ for more details. Even American Idol David Archuleta used to suffer this symptom after his surgery). These are uncontrollable risks of two-jaw surgery. Even the most experienced doctors dare not ascertain these risks will not occur when they perform the surgery. So be advised!

As for my case, very ironically, I suffered from all of the above-mentioned trauma. Damn it! Of course, Dr. Seo has advised me of these complications before the surgery and I myself was fully aware of them. So he is not to be blamed for my traumas!

As for the vocal cord problem, I couldn’t speak normally though after almost 3 months. Thus, I’m thinking of meeting a laryngologist soon! As for the Otitis Media, my ears are now okay after being treated with antibiotics for a month. What makes me more concerned now is my voice. Never did I wish to be a ‘Disney Mermaid” (who lost her voice in exchange for something?) after this surgery … quite scary !! I am an extremely talkative boy; hardly a day goes by without me talking and shooting the breeze with friends. Losing my voice means losing the whole world to me.

Ending: I’m not scaring you off the surgery but the risks are real and if you you’re intent on having it, be mentally prepared that these risks (some or all) may occurs to you. Be cautioned, dear my all forumers!!!!

 

[robinrenren]

Part 3: Monthly progress

Day 1:

before the surgery: Fast (no food, no water) for 12 hours, (super hungry and thirsty in the morning) + Pay off the surgery fee + meet Dr. Seo.

He was actually the one that checked upon me most often in the next 40 days, not Dr. Yoon. He informed me on all the procedures that Dr. Yoon and he was about to perform. There are 2 type of techniques to perform the two-jaw, the IVRO and BSSO… He strongly recommended me the first one as it causes least or Zero damage to the nerves and muscles (PROS of IVRO). I can sense all my lower jaw as fully (100%) as before the surgery. But my mouth would be kept shut and wired in 30-35 days (CONS of IVRO). For the latter, my mouth would not be wired and kept shut and the recovery period is around 23-25 days. (PROS of BBSO). However, it may well cause the lower jaw and the lower lip some lifetime numbness to as the bone will be cleft where nerves run through (CONS of BBSO). You can only sense about 50-60% of your lower jaw and lower lip after the surgery. 100% sensation is just wishful thinking. Unfortunately, this risk is unavoidable as I read in some medical articles about two-jaw. Dr.Seo said he always advised patients to choose the IVRO. Therefore, I strongly RECOMMEND that those who opt for two-jaw should choose IVRO and thus should stay at least 45 days in Seoul. As for me, I stayed there 2 months and 2 days, and of course, I went for the IVRO, though I know it would put me through more suffering than the BBSO, but it’s worth it because my sensation is secured 100%. With me, safety and well-being after the surgery should be prioritized. I never wanted to be a robot after the surgery, unable to sense my face anymore for the rest of my life. (Just imagine that your sweet heart kisses you and you couldn’t feel a thing in your lips!!! That’s disastrous!!!!)

After the surgery: the surgery last about 4 hours, according to the nurse. I woke up 30 mins after the surgery. (The general anaethesist, also a Yonsei graduate, was very accurate and professional, I would say). I still remember it was 3.30 PM when a lovely cutie nurse (not the crazy *****y curse) whose name I forgot rolled me on the wheelchair to the ward where I laid there for the next 7 days. As for me, I never felt thirsty at all after the surgery. That was weird as most people usually felt extremely thirsty after general anaethesia. All I wanted at that time was to sleep. I felt extremely sleepy. The nurses kept telling ‘please, do not sleep, please!!!!’ in the first few hours after the surgery. Shortly after I was moved to ward, the general anaethesist passed by and checked up on me. At that time, my swelling was on the increase. Then came Dr. Seo and informed that the surgery was successful. And last came Dr. Yoon around 9 PM with Dr. Seo to checked up on me again as my swelling was so bad at that time. This never occurred to other patients as they said. I couldn't sleep at all until 6 AM in the following day.

Day 2: the day of peaked swelling & all worst dramas
I literally just managed to have 20 –min shut-eye and then woke up and then tried to sleep again due to nasal blood and swelling blocking my breathing. I was trapped in this vicious circle until the 5fth day when the sleep was elongated a bit (30 mins. And then I woke up again) … not until day 10 did I have a sound 4-hour sleep. I was extremely hard of breathing and I had to walk along the aisle to gain some breath. This suffering was like forever and was really scary! You would feel very vulnerable at that time when you struggled to do the most basic thing to live, that is, BREATHE, BREATHE, and BREATHE!

I also had the nurse relieve 2 rubber bands to make it easier for me to breath, and Dr. Seo check up on me again during the day. He said we had to wait a few more days to have my jaws wired together as my swelling was so serious.

Day 3, day 4: swelling started to go down. I could only drink nutritious milk made in Korea (very similar to Ensure Gold) and juice and water to survive since day 2. Only 3 cans of 200ml this milk each + some juice per day will do. Note that this type of milk won’t cause any phlegm as MaiQ said in her thread in this forum (perhaps she meant the other fresh milk). Anyway, just drink this milk and you will be as right as rain! Besides, You guys won’t feel hungry at all as you’ll have the Intravenous fluids (like saline solution, and others) injected in your veins all the time since before the surgery until the day you leave the ward. So basically, I never felt any hunger until day 6 when the nurse stopped the fluid injection.

Day 5: Had my jaws wired in the morning as the swelling was going down then. I thought it would be ok after the jaws had been wired, but I was dead wrong. Dr. Seo said I might experience some pressure and might be harder of breathing. He was right! I found it more difficult to breath. I gasped for breath all the time. It was really scary and shocking. !!!!

Day 6, day 7: since day 5, I had literally needed blood suction every minute, but had to wait 8 hours for the next suction as it is really harmful for the wound inside my mouth and nose. How terrible it was to wait like this!
In the end, with the nasal spray, I managed not to have blood suction anymore. And kept using it every 8 hours to make it easier for me to breathe.

Day 7: I went home and had been bed-ridden since then… just lived on juice and nutritious milk + pumpkin juice. I also managed to walk about 1 hour per day to help my face de-swell faster.

Day 8 till day 20: there was no much improvement! Though I no longer struggled with breathing. (Thank goodness!)

Day 21: my face was still like a chipmunk and had the first check-up with Dr. Seo and we met each other every 4 days in the next 28 days to monitor my progress.

Day 33: Finally, my mouth was free from the wire.. I couldn’t be happier the moment my jaws were set free. But I was still unable to eat anything, and had to wear rubber bands and wafer until day 45. So those who tell you guys that you can eat everything after 3 weeks are all liars !!!! I had to wait until day 45 that I could finally eat some rice and chew some small piece of ground pork. Next, I had to do mouth physiotherapy every day until the next 6 months.

Day 35: started to have some porridge and cream soup but not much at a time. My face was getting better and better

Day 44: had everything inside my mouth removed (screws, rubber band, wafer, etc).

Day 45: the first day I managed to have some rice and noodle. I almost burst out into tears because up to then, I was so depressed and desperate. I couldn’t believe I was able to eat again after days of suffering.

Day 55: I started to diversify my meals (I could almost eat everything that is soft and cut in small pieces)

I was picking up day by day!

Day 57: symptom of middle-ear infection started to occur! Oh dear … Dr. Seo prescribed me some antibiotics and took them until a month later.

Day 60: suspicion of lymph node on the right side of the neck, below the jaw. + had final review with Dr. Yoon + Dr. Seo + have after-operation Xray + CT + pictures to see how my profile was improved. Everything was very good as expected.

Day 62: back to London and rest



Medicine recommendation:

Just take Calcium 500 mg (1 pill each day) + collagen +C (very good for nerves, muscles, joints) + multiVitamin … those should do!

 

[robinrenren]

Month 2 (updated on 30 April 2015 ): I have been cured of the lymph node and middle-ear infection by doctors in London and have had Xray , CT, MRI, untra-sound (radiology) tests. All doctors here were very amazed at the skill of Dr. Yoon & Dr. Seo when they examined my Xray + MRI + CT. they kept asking where did I had this surgery and who did it!!!! I said my surgery was performed by a Yonsei Med graduate in Seoul, South Korea! 

Take it from me, Seoul National Med school & Yonsei Med school are really worldwide famous.


My face is getting better and better and gaining new shape!
Of course, my satisfaction level now is around 5/10.. I had to wait another 4 months to see the final result but I quite like my new profile now, especially the chin !!!

I will come back here each month to update you guys on my progress. So stay tune!!!


bye !!

satisfaction level in this month: 5/10 stars

 

[robinrenren]

Month 3: to be updated later

Month 4: to be updated later

 

[robinrenren]

Month 5: to be updated later

Month 6: to be updated later

Month 7: to be updated later

 

[robinrenren]

(reserved post ) in case I need to jot down some side update for you guys

 

[chibiowl]

I haven't read this yet but I'm just going to thank you in advance and comment later because I'm male as well and looking to do similar surgeries as you and male plastic surgery is just so rare. THANK YOU SO MUCH, I hope you can answer some questions I might have.

 

[hanohano]

Thank you so much for sharing your experience, especially since a lot of us here on PF are interested in EverM. Just a question, are hospitals that are affiliated with the universities (for e.x. Yonsei) generally better-equipped/safer than hospitals that aren't, or does it really not make a difference?

 

[robinrenren]

Yes it is... it is the case all around the world, in my opinion... As Medical Universities are the places that "produce" future doctors .. --> Med University Hospitals should be more reputable and of higher quality (E.x Harvard Med uni Hospital)

 

[bigjaw]

can you message me your before and after pic?

 

[chibiowl]

Okay so now that I've read it, I have a few questions to ask:
1) So how much do the individual surgeries cost at Everm?
2) Where did you stay and how much did lodging cost a night? Because I personally don't think I want to pay for an extra week of lodging to wait for Everm.

Thanks!

 

[robinrenren]

chibiowl said: ↑

Okay so now that I've read it, I have a few questions to ask:
1) So how much do the individual surgeries cost at Everm?
2) Where did you stay and how much did lodging cost a night? Because I personally don't think I want to pay for an extra week of lodging to wait for Everm.

Thanks!

Click to expand...

Please read my words above carefully !

you may use airbnb website to find cheap accommodation !