asin Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 sliverlight... where do you find all this crazy stuff??? first, the pictures of that couple and now this. i wonder if it was her own idea to inject cooking oil into her face. this is so sad. she was probably not even unattractive to begin with. i thought the worse case scenario of plastic surgery gone bad was jocelyn wilderstein. i would like to see more cases of plastic surgery gone wrong in asia, since it's so common there. it seems like most of the asian celebrities i see with plastic surgery have beautiful results, leading me to think that plastic surgery is foolproof. you just need to have the time, money, and desire to do it. i've mentioned this before, but i live in vegas where plastic surgery is pretty common. i have seen many asian women here with bad nose jobs. their noses are often too high, straight, and fake looking. some of them have nostrils that are extremely uneven. the bad nose jobs i have seen are often on asian women in their 30's and up. maybe it's because they got their surgeries long ago when surgeons weren't that experienced, and implants just start to look bad over time? i'm just wondering where are all the asian celebrities with bad results like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkryu Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Take a cab. You will probably not feel well enough after 1 day. The pain meds will also make you drowsy. I recently saw an episode of Dr. 90210 where a lady who had work done on her face got into a car accident. She was the driver. Her chin implant shifted and her eyes were swollen. The Dr. told her that there was nothing he could do then point because there was too much swelling and that now she had prolonged her healing time. I took a cab everywhere for the 5 days I was there. I spent a fortune but I had already anticipated the expense and set some cash aside. I walked to the clinic from the apartment on the 4th day just to get a little exercise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cersepn Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Great point! The thing is, people don't notice good nose jobs.. only bad ones. I would like to think that there are in fact, many more rhino-ed people than we, or even the general public, believes. Actually i have seen quite a few bad nose jobs on celebrities, korean celebrities. It looks bad to me cos my eye's sorta trained after all this time, but to most people they go 'wow what a beautiful nose'. The trend in PS has been and probably will continue to change. It used to be that for women in korea, they would have straight, tall bridges with a very pointed tip. But now, their noses are much more delicate, with the very slight slope that is characteristic of a female nose. The tip is also more natural, with more flesh, rather than being very sharp and narrow. With more and more clinics rising up and competition becoming stiff, i think the surgeons there are hard pressed to improve their skills and establish a name for themselves. Afterall, reputation is everything. With all that said, i'm glad we're borned not in our mother's time - the time when plastic surgery had this huge stigma of it being 'fake' and all, not to say that it's not true now, but because the results are much better and more importantly, natural.. people are opening up to it. Plus the doctors' skills back then were.. questionable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asin Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 can someone tell me what are the possible complications of specifically I shaped implants, and how likely they will occur? i'm still trying to make a decision on whether to replace my implant or remove it altogether. i have been browsing the web obsessively for information. i've read a lot of bad things about L shaped implants but couldn't find much about I shaped implants. possible complications of L shaped implants are infection, dislocation, mobility, extrusion, transparency and glistening or the dorsal skin, and nasal skin changes. has anyone heard about those problems occuring with I shaped implants? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cersepn Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Actually, i have read in a medical report that I implants, by virtue of their shape, are less stable than the L implants. I think you shouldn't worry so much. From what i've read, all those complications with the L implants are more due to surgical errors; doctors aren't always the best at what they doing, especially when it's rhinoplasty. Didn't you go to dr charles lee? He's supposed to be one of the best in the states for asian rhinoplasty right, so relax. What is it you're not happy about your nose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asin Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 im 5 weeks post op and my nose is too high and slightly slanted to the right. i had the dr look at pictures of my nose. he said that the original platform of my nose was slightly tilted to the right, which caused the implant on my nose to be slanted slightly to the right. the dr says he can either remove the implant or replace it with a smaller one. he may have to shave the bone a little so that the platform is even before putting in a new implant. that way, the new implant can sit straight on my nose this time. im trying to decide whether i should just give up on implants altogether. i'm weighing the pros and cons and trying to find out what are the chances that putting in a new implant will go bad in the future. by less stable, do you mean in terms of mobility? i'm looking at this site and they have many photos of silicone implants gone bad due to extrusion, dislocation, discoloration, and contraction. there is also a picture of calcified implants on there. i don't know if many of those cases are L implants, and done by unqualified doctors.http://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=47&page=3&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cersepn Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Almost all are of those noses are L implants. I implant is usually used only when there's not much nose bridge to raise. Yes.. it's quite hard to put in words, but basically the I tends to be more mobile. It's really quite a gray area, cos many times you don't know whether complications arise due to implant/doctor error or just that the body can't take it. There's alot of factors. I meant unqualified not in the sense that they're quack doctors practicing without a medical license, but trained, qualified doctors - just trained in the wrong technique. Did you also have a cartilage graft done for the tip? I assume you're asian? Honestly, i'm more for autologous tissue aka rib/septal/ear than foreign implants. There's really nothing foreign implants offer over autologous tissue except the fact that it's a HELL of a lot easier for the surgeon to do (don't need to carve that much of the implant, shape is pretty much fixed), and much faster for him (1-1.5 hr max surgery time) => which translates into more patients.. and yea you guessed it, more money I frequently see in dr's websites that they don't do rib cos it's a much more invasive procedure and prone to warping (BTW, warping is really not a big issue in the hands of a skilled surgeon.. again it's all down to skill) That is true, but they leave out the most important thing - it's part of YOUR body. I wouldn't go back to your doctor if i were you. Think about it, there was NO way he couldn't have known that your bridge wasn't perfectly straight. Yet he chose to go ahead with the rhino fully aware that you would end up with a slanted bridge. Think about it, a plastic surgeon handling sooo many noses couldn't have seen that coming? Sounds pretty unethical. Plus he's gonna charge you 600 to replace the implant.. when the implant costs like what? Less than a 100 bucks? And i'm being very generous with that amount already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cersepn Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Just some stuff that i extracted from medical journals.. it's not accessible to the public. I'm abusing my college's system lol. "A major disadvantage of silicone is its notorious mobility after implantation and its propensity for extrusion if traumatized or exposed. Nevertheless, silicone has been very popular for nasal augmentation in Asian patients. Its success in this population is aided by the relatively thick skin-soft tissue envelope over the implant. Silicone grafts have given good results in primary but not in secondary rhinoplasty, where a 42% failure rate has been reported.Ham and coworkers reviewed 1500 cases of augmentation rhinoplasty with silicone and found an 18% incidence of complications which they attributed to implant design, or unskillful operative technique. Similar to Ham and coworkers, the tip was the most common site of extrusion. A greater rate of extrusion and infection was associated with larger implants. The shape of the implant is important, with L-shaped implants for dorsal and tip augmentation being the most vulnerable for extrusion (4-fold greater rate of extrusion than with any other implant shape).In summary, the use of silicone seems to result in an unacceptably high complication and dissatisfaction rate based on large retrospective trials. Nevertheless, it is frequently used in Asia, and McCurdy cites refinements in technique, the design of the implant (softer elastomer), and patient selection that may be responsible for a lower rate of complication than generally reported." And.. from another article "Unfortunately, because of their permanent nature, many of these alloplastic materials are fraught with long-term complications, such as infection, migration, extrusion, and palpability." "prefabricated L-shaped configuration that acts as an onlay graft for both the dorsum and tip. It enhances dorsal height, improves tip definition and projection, counter rotates the tip, and even corrects columellar retraction. The authors of series that have up to 10 years of follow-up in Asia report a very low acceptable rate of implant infection, extrusion (0-7.9%), and malposition (5%). At the host–implant interface, there exists some micro-motion between the implant and the capsule, increasing the risk of infection compared with porous implants. As a consequence, there is a lack of enthusiasm for this implant in the Western world." I'll dig out more bits and pieces when i have the time. You'll notice that most of the time, the only reason cited in medical literature as to why asian skin takes foreign implants better.. is that the skin is thicker. That is really quite scary if you think about it. This means that the implant is still poking the skin and wants to 'get out'; only thing stopping the implant from extruding is the skin thickness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asin Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 i think most of the "extrusion, tip infection," and the "contraction" cases are due to L implants. however, it looks to me like some of the others are I implant cases. even if most of them are L implant cases, they appear to be general complications of silicone/silastic (are they more or less the same thing?) implants regardless of shape. for example:*crookedness/shifting of the implant, and the outlines of the implant becoming visible. the bridge area of the nose is affected, not the tip/columnella. aren't I shaped and L shaped implants essentially the same in the bridge area?http://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=45&page=3&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1http://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=57&page=3&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1http://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=23&page=5&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1*calcification of the implants - you can see the I implants that were removed in the pictures and the calcification. this is supposed to happen to all silicone implants regardless of its shape: http://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=50&page=3&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1 *abscess in the glabella regionhttp://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=60&page=3&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1 take a look at this one (WARNING: graphic). the persons nose is opened up and you can see the implant inside. is this an I implant or a trimmed L implant? there is no strut.http://www.nose.co.kr/english/other/read.asp?idx=42&page=4&S_Kinds=Title&S_STR=&flag=13&LangType=1 i don't really know what to say to that. i don't know if he made a pretty big error or this is something that just happens because not every operation comes out perfect. i would trust him to do a simple removal of the implant. i just hope that my nose will look okay without the implant. honestly, i think the base of my nose/nostrils look good right now. it looks like it is just the size and crookedness of the implant that is unfavorable. my nose is not terribly slanted; it is weird because it is a lot more noticeable in some lightings than others. i didn't think $600 was unreasonable to replace the implant. maybe it's because i was expecting to pay more. aren't there surgical and anesthesia fees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asin Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 thanks for posting those medical journal snippets. i miss having access to pubmed, ha ha. i wonder how many of the cases on that korean site are due to unskillful operative technique. what about all the middle aged women i have seen around town with bad nose jobs? they all had unskillful surgeons? it seems to me like implants start to look bad and become more visible over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cersepn Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Hard to say, it could very well be the skills.. or an inherent problem with foreign implants. It's also quite likely those woman had their noses done when the surgeons haven't had refinements in technique.. the way they do now. Take for instance Korea, most of their PS clinic websites i've seen, utilise this approach now - silicon bridge with tip graft. Those implants all look like L to me. There are some I in that bunch.. but rather few. Alot of them have had their collumelar strut, which is the _ part in the L trimmed, which is why it looks short and almost like an I. I'm pretty sure that most of the good clinics that aren't on the web (Why should they be? They've got all the business they need) should be using these techniques and more. It wasn't the case last time, when they just used the implant without tip grafting, leading to the common extrusion and complications etc. It's not so much about the amount of money you're paying, it's more of an ethics thing. He didn't do a good job on your nose.. and he's charging you for him to fix his mistake? It doesn't sound right to me. In case you don't already know this, doctors have a good idea of what your nose looks like immediately post-op as the swelling has not set in yet. You might be wondering why a rhinoplasty might take 1-1.5 hours if it's so simple, assuming it's a closed approach. It's because they take out and insert the implant multiple times to make sure it looks good, trimming it in the process etc. In other words, the doctor definitely gets a good look of how the bridge looks like. Sorry, but i really don't see how that was an honest mistake by the doctor. Oh and regarding that graphic pic? That white part IS the strut. That's precisely what i meant by the strut pressing against the inside of the nose.. and because asians have thicker skin, that pressure exerted by the strut is better tolerated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazygirl1 Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Asin, I agree with cerpn. Dr. Lee seems to have put you through the operation, knowing that your nose will look slightly slanted. I think he thought you wouldn't mind or wouldn't notice? If the platform was already slanted, he should have addressed that in the consultation when he assessed your nose in detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leilalilu Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Any of you guys who've already had nose jobs with implants planning to go back to your doctors to get a checkup on them in 10 years? I understand that you should probably maintain them and make sure there isn't anything wrong with them every 10 years or so. Dr. Lee said it was really up to me if I wanted to go back to him to have it checked up. I was just thinking if I should go back every 10 years or so just to be safe instead of waiting to have something happen like an infection or extrusion then go to him. So any of guys gonna do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkryu Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 When I went for the final consultation before the surgery, they had me sign a form regarding revisions. I think they said it would be $1500 for a revision. If it was Dr. Lee's fault, then it would be no cost. It sounds like it was Dr. Lee's oversight, therefore you shouldn't be charged to get this revision. You should mention this to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cersepn Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Just make sure that if you see something amiss with your nose, like skin discoloration, pus or some weird skin pigmentation on the tip/bridge, DON'T hesitate to go down immediately. No hate, and i hope your nose lasts 10 years.. but we'll see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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