migookinamja Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Well I got my cast off. Not sure what to say. I'm not in love with my nose. Dream sent me my before photos and they are hideous. This nose IS way better than that. My main concern is that I still have a hump. I was a bit concerned about it before the surgery because I could see from my ct scan that my hump is mainly cartilage and to bring it down to have a straight transition with my nasal bones would mean losing bridge height. Maybe it actually looks better this way and the nose I imagine is not possible without implant. I do really really like the symetry, proportions look good. Tip looks good. Maybe it is just swelling. Its not like he didn't do anything to the hump...my bones feel a little loose. I will take pictures today but only post at 2 weeks since noone claimed that it was supposed to even look normal at 1 weeek. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rooky Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Bisousx, I think you are very pretty and yes you look a little mixed but there is nothing wrong with that, and that is the true American! There are lots of grown men that behave less mature than they should have been and have yet learned to respect others. Trust me, I know just too many of them. I'll just ignore them. You are a very nice person and you deserve to be treated nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angleplane Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 @Rawdude: You said :"@angleplane i think joan wasnt upset about you, im not her so i dnt wana speak for her.but my opinion is that shes upset about this whole unimportant issue that is stirring up all over places right now causing a misunderstanding. Well small thing, lets let it rest for now. If you want to pursue just pm me. I can tell u just one very simple thing dat u d done at officetel and u ll go speechless . Nuff said. Ps: i shall stop posting for now n will not respond to anything except a new material or better clinic being introduced. Thats all, happy healing" I am sorry to say that, but your post makes me think that you are part of VIP or at least very biased, because : -I asked who you were while in Korea. Someone told me you are from Singapore. So, if you are from there, how can you be aware that Joann is upset about me or not. Are you not just a previous patient ? Also, nothing excludes the fact that you can be hired. Eg: Kara from the Cozycot forum is a previous patient of Dr Song (from another clinic) and she still earns money for patients she brings to him. It is very diplomatic to say that Joann is not upset at me, thank you for saying that anyway. But how can she be upset at a patient ? Also, you are using her exact same vocabulary. After the liposuction and in her car as she was driving another patient to Officetel and me to my hotel (50m from Officetel), I asked her "But, I still don't understand, what happened that I was treated differently ?" and she answered the CT scan cost only and would always conclude "this was just a misundertanding", same for the money transfer and them pressuring me "that was a misunderstanding", and now, here on this forum again this was just a "misunderstanding", even though you're supposed to not be linked to VIP clinic and you're just a previous patient from Singapore. I don't think any of the other previous patients are as aware as you are about what you call yourself "small problems" that occur at VIP clinic. To your sentence : " I can tell u just one very simple thing dat u d done at officetel and u ll go speechless" Is that a subtle way to let people think that I may have done something wrong that would justify the way I was treated ? Also, if I did something that would keep me speechless, I think I would remember it. I have not done anything that would justify a bad treatment by VIP clinic. The only impression you give is that it's better to get our own accommodation than paying expensive prices and staying at Officetel and then, being reproached lots of things. Once again, I have always left the room in which I stayed as I found it and I even threw away the garbage in the basement, I don't think every patient can say they went to B2 floor of Apex building to throw away their garbage. Also, if you're a just a previous patient and nothing more, how can you be aware of what another patient have done during its stay in Officetel ? As to PMing you, I have no interest in communicating with some that I don't know, who doesn't know me, but who's trying to throw suspicion on me just because I shared my entire experience, the negative and positive sides. It is difficult to understand why because I have just shared my entire experience, I am now subject to reprisals. Now that I think of your posts, I am thinking that you were just directing this forum, so people would discuss about VIP clinic, also your posts worked as an "after sales" service so only "VIPians" as you say (who I think are genuine customers), would gather and talk about their happy experience at VIP, making other potential patients sound boring if they started mentioning other clinics. That's why people like Jenstar11 would not share her experience from another clinic. I talked to other patients while at VIP and concerning the things they were not satisfied about, they said "Yeah, but I don't write that on the forum", I said "Same for me ! I don't write that on the forum" because I had the feeling that it wasn't welcome and I knew I was going to be attacked if I said less positive things about my experience. It was not easy for me to stand up and answer to each post that supposedly revealed my true colors. Before I posted my last posts to defend myself, I had to think to answer in the most objective way, to protect myself and not be bashed some more. I lost two evenings thinking of this, almost regretting that I stated everything I went through. It really saddened me that I had to defend myself and justify every little things I did or did not do, because all I did was sharing my entire experience. And to your last sentence : "Ps: i shall stop posting for now n will not respond to anything except a new material or better clinic being introduced. Thats all, happy healing" Because suddenly, we're not "onesided", all positive about VIP. You will stop posting. Then, I guess you have nothing to say except praising the clinic and listing happy customers. It is better for the forum, for the flow of information about rhinoplasty, if there isn't one trying to direct the conversations toward one end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migookinamja Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 I love my nose... I hate my nose... It's okaaaayyyyy... Repeat 10x per hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rooky Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Hi angelplane, Thank you for posting your experience at VIP, especially about the price. I wasn't going to mention but as Jenstar11 stayed, I too was qouted $5000 more for revision, which is on top of the $9500 rib nose, and $1500 paranasal. I know price are something people not like to discuss, so it has been kinda hush hush. But I think it really should be flat price for everyone. I know someone who had a difficult revision case (mutilple previous surgeries) and only paid around $9000 total. I wonder if it is this forum makes VIP sorta famous so VIP just raise the price on people who came from reading the forum. Nevertheless, I really appreciate all the nice people who reply to my questions regarding their experience, Kain is always helpful, Bisousx is the sweestest. I won't name more...I do appreciated all of your help. A side question: I would really like to see your experience at Smallface. I searched your previous posts and didn't see you have posted about them. If you already have and I missed it please let me know which page that is. If you haven't, would you mind telling me: how many days after your nose job that you operate on you mandible? Did you wish you waited longer, or it doesn't matter? Was it as pleasant experience. I saw that you said you like your smaller face so I assume you are happy with work done. How much was it? Do they speak English? I called a few times and got hung up on. If you have a contact or consultation at smallface that you work with, please forward me the email/#'s. I would like to talk with them. Thanks again for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwilola Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 I would like to know what transportation is the best for the people like me who dont speak Korean. The email just asked me to take the limo bus #6020 to gangnam station. OMG, i have never been to Korea, that is what i worry about. I thought they provide the pick up service from the airport O o????? How much is your eyelid surgery cost? Thanks so much if you can let me know more details about what I should expect....thanks for your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenstar11 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Ive gathered all the questions, private msgs included, that people have asked me so far and will answer them here. Im sure others may have the same questions and I dont want to repeat myself so Ill write it here for all to see. Here are the websites that my friend gave me. Note the only ones that have lots and lots of before and afters are vip and o&young. Dr. Moo Hyun Paik : 101 Plastic Surgery Clinic http://www.ps101.co.kr/language/index1.jsp Dr. Young Hwan Oh : O & Young Plastic Surgery Clinic http://koclub.com/ Dr. Myung Ju Lee : VIP Plastic Surgery Clinic http://www.vipps-clinic.com/ Dr. Man Koon Suh : Jung Won Plastic Surgery Clinic http://jwbeauty.net/ Dr. Jae Hoon Kim : April 31 Clinic http://www.april31.co.kr/ 1. So you have a silicone bridge and rib tip right? You said that JW isn't really catered to foreigners, if so, how did you book your consult? Did you email them? I've been looking at their rhino pics and the results seem pretty nice and natural. As for the price, it sounds pretty reasonable and def cheaper than VIP. If I may ask, where are you staying now and how much is it costing per night? Yes, I have silicone for the bridge and rib for tip. My friend contacted dr. suh first while in the states and made an arrangement for her consultation. She arrived 1 week before me and had the consultation with him. She then made the appt for me to consult with him when I arrived. Initially, I was going to have surgery with vip 1 day after I arrived so when I cancelled 5 days prior to getting there, I freaked out completely. After cancelling, I realized transportation, hotel, etc..on me now and that was quite scary. Anyhow, so I booked a hotel online that was about 15 min away from the PS district (due to not knowing where exactly the PS district is). After consulting with dr. suh, the office manager made reservation for the nearby hotel, Sunshine hotel, its about a 3 min walk from the clinic. I paid in think $80 with their connection but if you book online, I think its like 120 or more. Ive been back to the states for about close to 2 weeks now. I only stayed 9 days after surgery although I shouldve stayed longer. That was because I was supposed to have surgery with vip and so that messed up my schedule. Anyhow, I recommend you to stay at least 11-12 days after surgery, especially in my case where I also did mandibular reduction. 2. do you know how difficult it is to remove rib bridge? also, how much experience does dr. suh have in rhinoplasty? Im sure its difficult to remove rib so you want to go to a doctor whos skilled at revision. I dont know how much experience dr. suh has with rhinoplasty but he was recommended by another surgeon. He said dr. suh is very reputable in rhinoplasty and revision, he also teaches at the university. 3. May I ask what material you had before the toriumi's rib? Did you use silicon before but didn't work? My 1st surgeryear cartilage (warped). 2ndwith gortex. 3rd- Rib with toriumi. Ive never had silicon. Also note I was young and naïve for my 1st and 2nd and didnt do any research. I found this one local white doctor and regret going to him because he probably has no experience working on asian rhinoplasty. 4. May i ask what JW stands for? May i also ask is South Korea's plastic surgery tax now in action? i am interested in O&young and Banogani - what did u think of their results? - what was your impression of the doctors? - are they specialized in Rib? - why didnt u choose these two? I have no idea what the new tax on surgery is. I didnt consult with O&young. My friend consulted with them and was very turned off by them. They proposed cadaver rib on her and she was not pleased and she was not impressed with the noses on the receptionists there who got their noses done by that clinic. She said their noses were high and pointy (unnatural looking) Although Banobagi was not listed on the list (my friends plastic surgeon friend said they were not known for revision), I consulted with them anyhow because I heard someone on the forum had a really good result with dr. lee (not vip) there. I think dr. lee is really good with primary rhinoplasty because his before and after photos look amazing. I felt dr. lee seemed somewhat intimidated by my case and didnt sound confident when talking to him so I sensed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenstar11 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 [I was wondering will it be okay too if you can share your review and thoughts on your mandibular reduction result? As I am currently doing research on which doctor and clinic to go to for mandible reduction procedure as I am interested of getting my double eyelid done the same time as mandible reduction under the same clinic if possible so I only need to go under anesthesia only once and not twice(^ ^;; Are you happy with the result? Which method did the doctor used? Does he also perform masseter muscle reduction the same time ? How much does it cost for your mandibular reduction at JW?] I feel the same way regarding having surgery at one place and thats why I chose to have the mandibular reduction the same time and same clinic as my rhino. It makes things a little easier. So far, I am happy with my result. I had a very angular/square face so its made my face slightly smaller than before. The result is subtle from the frontal view at the time but very significant from the profile view. I am only a little over 3 weeks so the final result isnt until 1 or 1.5 months later. My face is still stiff from the muscle reduction so smiling and laughing is not back to normal yet. The method he used was the angle curve dissection where they cut the angle of the mandible and that cut is extended close to the chin area without touching the chin though. Its a gradual cut. He also reduced the masseter muscle at the same time. My masseter muscle was hypertrophic also. Before I went back to the states, he injected botox to the masseter muscle to reduce swelling and the muscle some more. I feel less conscious when putting my hair up now. I used to not like putting my hair up because it brings out the square jawline but I like putting my hair up now. I paid $11,000.00 total for my rhino and jaw. $6500 for nose and $4500 for jaw. I thought they were going to charge me for the botox injection since it wasnt part of the surgery but they didnt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenstar11 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 well-said angleplane. I've always been suspicious. How come he always seem to know what Joann is thinking? Why does a patient who has had surgery months ago still keep in touch with Joann on a regularly basis and has the desire to know the ins and outs of patients of that clinic? It is unusual to say the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kain Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 its possible, but 'misunderstanding' is a fairly common word. # also, i still email joann occasionally. i asked her about my wisdom tooth removal for example, and had some chat about the clinic and stuff. maybe he just asked by email? i usually get a reply in two or three days at most. but i think this forum has always been open to ppl posting about other clinics. ppl have posted results from dr kao, hsu, jung, and some others as well. the reason discussions tend toward vip is that most ppl who post, happen go to vip. i dont think rawdude has been directing the discussions lately, as he hasnt posted in a while. lots of ppl who went to vip posted of their own initiative, including the ppl that you met at vip. and ppl are free to post criticism as well. if they dont, its due to their own reservations. uzura, hher, and you for example and destiny and i disclosed the fact that we got UTIs, which isnt a very good thing for a clinic to have anyways, as is often said: "there are three sides to a story, one side, the other side, and the truth" not to imply that anyway is being untruthful, but ppl are inevitably biased lets try to be objective about everything here. i'll post the important points and some comments and ppl can decide for themselves you said joann resented you cos you send too much info(4 pdfs and 1 powerpoint), rushed you and dr lee -i agree that she shouldnt have responded like that, as she handles emails and is therfore responsible for maintaining good communication with customer. and i dont think she should let personal issues affect her customer relations. -you also have to realise though, that giving joann all that info isnt rly useful. you should have brought it on a usb stick to show dr lee during the consultation. joann cant do much with that info and she is very busy, as past patients can see. she sometimes spends 12 hours working a day from what i've seen. dr lee would be more receptive to the kind of info you wanted to show. -i do wonder what was on those files though. short of planning out your entire surgery for dr lee, i cant imagine why there would be so much info. i'm guessing there were lots of pictures? -i kinda doubt that the nurses, who are not even aware of administrative fees, would resent you over that. nor do i think that the secretaries would care much. maybe joann or dr lee might be a bit miffed, but when they did my second set of exams after i got the UTI, nobody made a fuss. maybe they were bitter, but its seems unlikely to me -that does seem rly strange to me, as you did say you spent a lot of money at the clinic. but i still think this extends only to joann and a few administrative staff. -the receptionist isnt going to do a nurses job. you should have gone upstairs and asked a nurse. there are nurses there 24/7 and they dont have anything else to do. i got my steri-strips put on during a dressing session. i think you said you missed a lot of sessions, which is why you didnt get it put on by dr lee or dr song. dr lee put mine on (the first one is free) and told me not to take them of, but to let them fall off by itself. so i didn't need to change it at all cos it stayed on for weeks. -i do agree that it seems overpriced, but there was a pharmacy on the same block. you could have asked for directions or bought supplies before going to korea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kain Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 -yellowsuitcase responded "btw, we included you in the korean culture dance. You were having your full lower body lipo on the day itself so JoAnn didn't want you running around town so soon after surgery. But after you asked to be included, she did say yes and counted you in when making the reservations remember? You were there as well when she recounted and said she would make a reservation for 8." -bisousx responded "@angleplane I'm really sorry that you felt that way. Personally I thought you were pretty and nice, and I enjoyed our conversations as well. I was there when Joann talked about the Korean show, and in my opinion, yes the conversation between you guys was a bit awkward. She did include you in the reservation number of 8. One of the other patients asked Joann (privately) why the conversation went down like that, and Joann replied saying she did not know if some of the patients were uncomfortable with you and did not want to assume anything... based on what happened previously with the Officetel room situations. But we all liked you, and also I PMed you to see if you were going to join us for the show. I think Joann was put on the spot and tried to answer in a diplomatic way, and tried to avoid embarrassing everyone involved. I hope you continue to heal well." -i think bisousx is right. if you read joann's responses, she offered to let you go with another group, because she isnt sure how the current group thought of you. regarding being kicked out of the officetel - they did offer to provide you with a hotel after your payment went through, but not until a few days later. i agree that it was rather careless of them, considering you were in recovery from your surgeries at smallface. -Kekekeke responded "Joann actually spoke to me about reasons why she did not want angleplane in their offictel (I'm not going to explain it here though). To angleplane: After you went to my room for 1 night, and then townstory's, you went back to your old room and slept for 2 nights even after Joann wanted you to leave. Joann did actually know that you were still in the offictel, but she did not kick you out even then." and "I understand that you were still recovering, but I faced a lot of problems with your messiness even though you were only with me for 1 night. To be honest, 3 patients (including me) complained to Joann about your messiness and that is the reason why Joann had to pay for the hotel because none of us wanted to share a room with you." -this does seem like a reasonable explanation, as joann has a responsibility to all the other patients as well. -yellowsuitcase responded "Personally, I agree that more information is good and it would benefit future rhinoplasty patients. It's also good to share experiences but when sharing, shouldn't we tell the whole truth rather than selectively hiding certain information so as to distort the picture? Why did you not mention that you were so messy that no other patients wanted to room with you? Or that you just about wrecked the room you were staying in at the officetel? I moved into your room right after you left and the computer was wrecked totally. The cables were pulled out and lying about and nothing was working. There were no hangers, plates, bowls, fork, and knife even though they were still all there on 19th when you were in the room and every room i've been to in the officetel has them. " -angleplane responded "Anyway, the computer in the 7th floor did not work when I arrived. I never pulled the cables, since I only used the ethernet cable for my Mac. It is true that I had a lot of stuff with me and that may look messy when taken out of the bags. I have always left the room as it was when I left, I even threw away the garbages before leaving. If you took the room from the 7th floor, it was not messy when I left it and usually someone cleans it before another person arrives." and "but it is easy to call someone messy, you just have to unpack your luggage and it's already a mess" -other ppl have had procedures done at other clinics without any problem. -so they resented you because you got the face bone exams, and hated you because you went to another clinic? the staff really did not seem to be the type to feel so strongly about something as common in the business as 'going to another clinic.' it seems rly unlikely to me considering that they all have lives outside the clinic, and how much money dr lee makes doesnt rly concern the nurse of secretary, for example. but i guess joann could influence the staff, as she does have a position of authority. -shouislove responded "angleplane, i think you should of taken care of the bank transfer before the op. you said, you planned to, but made a mistake, so it didnt go through. you cant blame vip for being suspicious or whatever. usually you have to pay at least a deposit before the op, but vip trusted you and performed the op without payment. i mean, you planned to stay in their officetel even though you were doing eyes and zygoma in other clinics :s and when told to leave, you stayed there without permission." -if you dont pay for a surgery yet decide to stand in the lobby, they will probably call the police and have you arrested for loitering in most clinics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kain Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 -it sounds a lot like you and joann just didnt get along. -i was okay having joann at the consultation. she does have a good eye for aesthetics and proportion. for example, she pointed out a facial asymmetry which i had never noticed before. i sorta brushed it off at first, and didnt rly believe it. but i got an xray at the dentist a while ago and she was right, my right mandible is different from the other one. its less wide, and also a bit higher. and she also spotted my septal deviation right away. if she recommended the paranasals, it was probably in conjuction with the chin augmentation. getting large paranasal implants usually go with chin augmentation. im surprised taht dr lee didnt give you smaller paranasals in consideration of the fact that you didnt get the chin augmentation, cos it would would mess up the proportion jenstar11 said i think its cos she seems to have a lot of negative things to say about joann. and most ppl who went to vip got along well with joann. and its just a natural human reaction to defend ppl whom they like not saying its justified, but its still the main reason imo. ppl here are entirely receptive to criticisms about the surgical result or even about the services provided at the clinic, as has been shown by reviews from uzura and hher. but angleplane's criticisms really seem like a personal issue with joann upon inspection, which is why ppl reacted so strongly. when i first read angleplane's posts, that was my first impression: joann and angleplane dont get along with each other. joann did a few petty things, and now angleplane is retaliating and also i dont think its fair to discredit everyone who has gone to vip. ie the ppl who recently went to vip have been driving the discussions lately. and you seem to be saying that they are advertising for vip... anyway, the content on this forum is built entirely from ppl who bother to post. if you want to help promote sharing info on other clinics, the best way to do that is to post websites for other clinics. for example, i couldnt find the website for jw clinic with google last week so i just gave up. it would be rly helpful to ppl if you posted the website. moreso than continually insunuating that ppl who post about vip are advertising for them. you've said that it was because ppl kept talking about vip that you with-held from posting info. well nobody actually stopped you from posting. the forum is the same as it has always been. ppl are free to post what they want, barring any imaginary limitations they have placed upon themselves. this one is sorta unrelated but when i told jay lee that i would be going to another clinic, he offered to advise me as a second opinion: "Thanks for your prompt reply. If you find a capable surgeon, you will be have great result. In Korea, there are a lot of good surgurgeons. so, I strongly believe and hope, you have great result. Also, if you have any question concerning plastic surgery, feel free to ask me. I will advise as a second point of view." so i asked some stuff, including: "And have you heard much about VIP clinic?" he replied on Tue 2/8/2011 1:04 AM "Sorry, I haven't heard about VIP clinic. There are more than 1,200 clinics and 1,700 plastic surgeons in Korea. I couldn't have all the information." so i think its kinda strange that he goes from knowing nothign about vip, to knowing something that would not be readily disclosed, and in such a short amount of time. i mean, it could very well be true. but you have to take what ppl say with a grain of salt right? the fact that he was so insistent about repeating it comes off as a bit strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kain Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 i still email joann occassionally. ie. to ask about my wisdom teeth, asking about my uneven swelling on my nose. and i did have some off-topic chat, which included things about the clinic and the staff. its not that unusual considering how well joann gets along with most patients. its not a far stretch to think that someone would ask joann about angleplane, considering how much of a fuss was being made here. but other than that, its good to see you sharing more info, like posting sites for some of the less known clinics here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenstar11 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 @Kain: ["i dont think its fair to discredit everyone who has gone to vip. ie the ppl who recently went to vip have been driving the discussions lately. and you seem to be saying that they are advertising for vip... anyway, the content on this forum is built entirely from ppl who bother to post. if you want to help promote sharing info on other clinics, the best way to do that is to post websites for other clinics. for example, i couldnt find the website for jw clinic with google last week so i just gave up. it would be rly helpful to ppl if you posted the website. moreso than continually insunuating that ppl who post about vip are advertising for them. you've said that it was because ppl kept talking about vip that you with-held from posting info. well nobody actually stopped you from posting. ] I am not discrediting anyone, well, maybe one in particular. I find that everyone else who has shared their experiences about vip has been genuine. I also do believe dr. lee is a very skilled doctor, i never said he wasn't. I just felt the need to speak up when everyone was attacking angleplane when she was telling her experience and side of the story. Why is it so hard for people to believe that someone can have a bad experience at vip? is it always positives with vip all the time that if she said anything negative then she's must be lying or there's something wrong with her? about me not posting the website to jw--i've been busy at work the entire day so i haven't gotten around to checking this forum and answering people's questions. I have a life outside of this forum too you know. Kain- you've been very helpful in answering all my questions while i was doing my research and that's been very much appreciated. I just find it unfair how people can bash someone else for speaking up on their experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anne10331 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Hey has anyone seen or been to Dream Clinic? There seems to be no before and after pics posted on the english version of their sight. Dr. Park quoted me $3000USD for endonasal augmentation rhinoplasty with ear + septal cartilage tip and silicone bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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